Marine Aquarium 3 Rumors and Speculation - Page 4

jroseone · 09-09-2006, 02:33 PM

Originally posted by Simple Steve:

I think a lot of the people on this board don't have a clue how long it will take Mr. Sachs to complete 3.0, or the effort it takes to do something like this. There's a reason I never got into programming. It's tedious, time-consuming, and sometimes frustrating work. The little bit that I've done is enough to convince me that I made the right decision in my IT career choice. I certainly wont say that I've done coding on the level of Mr. Sachs, but I think I can say with certainty that wishing him to go faster aint gonna make it happen.

Yes but has'nt Mr. Sachs been working on most of this stuff for quite some years now ? I remember when I first purchased Marine Aquarium, there was talks about these addons, and that was ages ago.

feldon34 · 09-09-2006, 02:51 PM

It all boils down to the fact that Jim Sachs is an artist and animator. He is not a programmer. He's forced himself through DirectX and C++ books to learn enough to write the Aquarium. It's remarkable to me what he's been able to do, given my limited knowledge of just how complex DirectX is to program (and it's 1,000 easier than it used to be).

And I guess Jim has been screwed over so many times by publishers, programmers, and pretty much anyone he has dared collaborate with over the last 20 years that getting outside help (even of an instructional nature) is completely out of the question.

Jim is trying to do animation and create interactive surfaces that only the upper echelon of DirectX programmers are even attempting, without the background they have.

Jim Sachs · 09-09-2006, 09:05 PM

Yep, looking over my C++ code, no one is more surprised than me that I can get this gibberish to do anything coherent at all.

Ian · 09-10-2006, 11:16 AM

Originally posted by Tiny Turtle:

Ian,
Could you describe the background a wee bit more? What was different?

/TT

Hi TT, sorry for the delay in replying.

The version I saw running in Edinburgh looked just like the current 2.x version, right down to the types of fish and the corals, etc. However, the corals appeared to be 3D models too, and they swayed about in the water.

I looked in the lower corners of all of the screens on display, but there was no telltale "SACHS" signature hidden in the stones as far as I could see.

It would appear that it must have been something other than our favourite, Marine Aquarium, but the resemblance was so uncanny!

cjmaddy · 09-10-2006, 12:20 PM

That single malt is strong stuff!

Icarus ^i^ · 09-11-2006, 09:19 AM

Fantastic

Surfed in here to upgrade my ancient version to 2.6 and discover that v3 is in the works!

Keep up the good work Jim

Absolutely looking forward to buying it for my new widescreen laptop.

jroseone · 09-11-2006, 07:36 PM

Originally posted by Jim Sachs:

Yep, looking over my C++ code, no one is more surprised than me that I can get this gibberish to do anything coherent at all.

More power to you Jim, your next generation Fish tank sounds like it will be awsome.

Kizayaen · 09-14-2006, 05:50 AM

I first ran across this product by using the Goldfish Bowl which was included with Windows XP Media Center Edition. I'm an aquarist in real life too, so the combination of gorgeous photo-perfect fish, realistic behaviour, and the option to choose from a large variety of animals sucked me in. I'm very pleased to have paid my $20 for v2.6 tonight.

After playing with it, I'd come up with a handful of things that I wanted to suggest as feedback, but then it turns out that they're all forthcoming in v3 already! Absolutely outstanding work! I can't wait to shell out more money for my v3 upgrade and start playing with the special critters.

Jim, keep up the absolutely fantastic work.

Highlander · 09-17-2006, 03:03 AM

Any news on the work in progress Jim ?

Jim Sachs · 09-17-2006, 11:36 AM

Nothing exciting. I'm working on it about 12 hours a day, but it's slow going - pure drudgery. Each tiny object has to be created then reworked countless times until it looks good from whatever angle the camera will see it from as it pans. Even though the viewing angle does not change radically, it's enough to show that the object isn't real. The elephant-ear coral that I'm working on right now is a good example of this. Since it has become something of an MA trademark, I feel compelled to include it, but I only have the one picture to go by. Using this as a texture, it must be projected onto the 3D object from the front, as the camera originally saw it. When the camera moves to the side even slightly, the texture becomes an incoherant mass of streaks.

So, I must create a new object closer to the viewer which will slide in front of the offending object, obscuring it as the camera position exposes an unacceptable angle. Then there's the problem of viewing THAT object from different angles, and so on... Oh, well - If I ever do get this finished, it should remain the gold standard of 3D simulations for a long time, because nobody else would be nuts enough to go through this again.

Highlander · 09-17-2006, 12:07 PM

Thanks for the update... keep in mind we are all support you !

ESHIREY · 09-17-2006, 01:20 PM

Agreed. We know you can do it buddy.

Tiny Turtle · 09-17-2006, 01:37 PM

Sounds like a lot of work. One picture, huh?

>1 picture.
>>1 picture.

/Tiny Stab in the Dark

Jav400 · 09-17-2006, 03:52 PM

Remember Jim, this is only within the miracle stage, it should only take minutes.

Jim Sachs · 09-18-2006, 01:41 AM

Tiny - nope, none of those are it. This is the pic I'm using (I took it in 2000):

Tiny Turtle · 09-18-2006, 09:21 AM

Ok.
Upon further googling, Im stating to think that's not an Elephant ear mushroom coral which is green in color, but the "Giant Cup mushroom" which sometimes is called "Giant Elephant ear coral" (Amplexidiscus fenestrafer).
More pics: 1 2 3 4 5.
I don't know if it's of any help to you, but I figure it was worh a shot.

/TT

Jim Sachs · 09-18-2006, 09:33 AM

Thanks, TT, but I need a shot of that exact (long-dead) coral from a little higher angle. The idea is that when MA3 pops up, the first impression is that you are looking at the current version, then the camera starts to pan and you realize that it's a 3D environment. Not everything in the current background picture can be used exactly as is, but that one piece of coral is probably the most recognizable item in the tank.

nicksteel · 09-18-2006, 09:50 AM

BANGKOK, Thailand - Scientists combing through undersea fauna off Indonesia's Papua province said Monday they had discovered dozens of new species, including a shark that walks on its fins and a shrimp that looks like a praying mantis.

Todays' Yahoo. "a shrimp that looks like a praying mantis" could be an interesting addition. Can't find picture yet.

Jav400 · 09-18-2006, 10:09 AM

Well that sounds interesting, find a decent photo and I will add it to the special creatures section of the web page.

Tiny Turtle · 09-19-2006, 03:17 AM

Jim, I figured you were looking for something likt that, but I fear I can't help you with the hand-pixling of that one...

Nick,
In a nature show on the TV a creature that looks so unique it's almost unnatural is a very cool thing. In a program like this the aimhas to be for the creatures to look as realistic as possible or everything in the tank will appear fake. What I'm trying to say is that footage of a fish with four eyes and a head that glows in the dark would be super cool, but if you put it in MA3 it would look about as relistic as if the lionfish had Homer Simpson's face...

/Tiny Parade-rainer

09-09-2006, 02:51 PM	#62
feldon34 Forum Administrator Join Date: Dec 2000 Location: Rock Hill, SC Posts: 10,939	It all boils down to the fact that Jim Sachs is an artist and animator. He is not a programmer. He's forced himself through DirectX and C++ books to learn enough to write the Aquarium. It's remarkable to me what he's been able to do, given my limited knowledge of just how complex DirectX is to program (and it's 1,000 easier than it used to be). And I guess Jim has been screwed over so many times by publishers, programmers, and pretty much anyone he has dared collaborate with over the last 20 years that getting outside help (even of an instructional nature) is completely out of the question. Jim is trying to do animation and create interactive surfaces that only the upper echelon of DirectX programmers are even attempting, without the background they have. "Journalism is printing what someone else does not want printed. Everything else is public relations." - George Orwell "If voting changed anything, they'd make it illegal." - Emma Goldman

09-09-2006, 09:05 PM	#63
Jim Sachs Developer Join Date: Dec 2000 Location: Southern Oregon Posts: 9,791	Yep, looking over my C++ code, no one is more surprised than me that I can get this gibberish to do anything coherent at all. Jim Sachs Creator of SereneScreen Aquarium

09-11-2006, 09:19 AM	#66
Icarus ^i^ Registered Join Date: Nov 2003 Location: .se Posts: 2	Fantastic Surfed in here to upgrade my ancient version to 2.6 and discover that v3 is in the works! Keep up the good work Jim Absolutely looking forward to buying it for my new widescreen laptop. Laptop: HP nx9420 \| Intel Core Duo T2400 1.83 Ghz \| 17" WSXGA+ Brightview \| ATI x1600 w/256MB \| 2GB DDR2 667MHz \| 80GB SATA 5400RPM \| DL-DVD +/- RW Drive Everquest 2: Ewexia lvl70 Wiz @ Splitpaw

09-17-2006, 03:03 AM	#69
Highlander Registered Join Date: Nov 2001 Location: Antwerp - Belgium Posts: 87	Any news? Any news on the work in progress Jim ? Never underestimate the power of stupid people in large groups !

09-17-2006, 11:36 AM	#70
Jim Sachs Developer Join Date: Dec 2000 Location: Southern Oregon Posts: 9,791	Nothing exciting. I'm working on it about 12 hours a day, but it's slow going - pure drudgery. Each tiny object has to be created then reworked countless times until it looks good from whatever angle the camera will see it from as it pans. Even though the viewing angle does not change radically, it's enough to show that the object isn't real. The elephant-ear coral that I'm working on right now is a good example of this. Since it has become something of an MA trademark, I feel compelled to include it, but I only have the one picture to go by. Using this as a texture, it must be projected onto the 3D object from the front, as the camera originally saw it. When the camera moves to the side even slightly, the texture becomes an incoherant mass of streaks. So, I must create a new object closer to the viewer which will slide in front of the offending object, obscuring it as the camera position exposes an unacceptable angle. Then there's the problem of viewing THAT object from different angles, and so on... Oh, well - If I ever do get this finished, it should remain the gold standard of 3D simulations for a long time, because nobody else would be nuts enough to go through this again. Jim Sachs Creator of SereneScreen Aquarium

09-09-2006, 02:33 PM	#61
jroseone Registered Join Date: Feb 2006 Posts: 93	Originally posted by Simple Steve: I think a lot of the people on this board don't have a clue how long it will take Mr. Sachs to complete 3.0, or the effort it takes to do something like this. There's a reason I never got into programming. It's tedious, time-consuming, and sometimes frustrating work. The little bit that I've done is enough to convince me that I made the right decision in my IT career choice. I certainly wont say that I've done coding on the level of Mr. Sachs, but I think I can say with certainty that wishing him to go faster aint gonna make it happen. Yes but has'nt Mr. Sachs been working on most of this stuff for quite some years now ? I remember when I first purchased Marine Aquarium, there was talks about these addons, and that was ages ago.

09-10-2006, 11:16 AM	#64
Ian Registered Join Date: Aug 2006 Posts: 2	Originally posted by Tiny Turtle: Ian, Could you describe the background a wee bit more? What was different? /TT Hi TT, sorry for the delay in replying. The version I saw running in Edinburgh looked just like the current 2.x version, right down to the types of fish and the corals, etc. However, the corals appeared to be 3D models too, and they swayed about in the water. I looked in the lower corners of all of the screens on display, but there was no telltale "SACHS" signature hidden in the stones as far as I could see. It would appear that it must have been something other than our favourite, Marine Aquarium, but the resemblance was so uncanny!

09-10-2006, 12:20 PM	#65
cjmaddy Registered Join Date: Nov 2001 Location: Lancashire, UK Posts: 7,854	That single malt is strong stuff!

09-11-2006, 07:36 PM	#67
jroseone Registered Join Date: Feb 2006 Posts: 93	Originally posted by Jim Sachs: Yep, looking over my C++ code, no one is more surprised than me that I can get this gibberish to do anything coherent at all. More power to you Jim, your next generation Fish tank sounds like it will be awsome.

09-14-2006, 05:50 AM	#68
Kizayaen Registered Join Date: Sep 2006 Posts: 5	I first ran across this product by using the Goldfish Bowl which was included with Windows XP Media Center Edition. I'm an aquarist in real life too, so the combination of gorgeous photo-perfect fish, realistic behaviour, and the option to choose from a large variety of animals sucked me in. I'm very pleased to have paid my $20 for v2.6 tonight. After playing with it, I'd come up with a handful of things that I wanted to suggest as feedback, but then it turns out that they're all forthcoming in v3 already! Absolutely outstanding work! I can't wait to shell out more money for my v3 upgrade and start playing with the special critters. Jim, keep up the absolutely fantastic work.

09-17-2006, 12:07 PM	#71
Highlander Registered Join Date: Nov 2001 Location: Antwerp - Belgium Posts: 87	Thanks for the update... keep in mind we are all support you ! Never underestimate the power of stupid people in large groups !

09-17-2006, 01:20 PM	#72
ESHIREY Smilie Dragon Join Date: Nov 2001 Location: Lebanon, PA Posts: 4,725	Agreed. We know you can do it buddy. Thank you for taking the time to read this.

09-17-2006, 01:37 PM	#73
Tiny Turtle is pleased Join Date: Mar 2001 Location: Stockholm, Sweden Posts: 7,365	Sounds like a lot of work. One picture, huh? >1 picture. >>1 picture. /Tiny Stab in the Dark Thanks to Morgan, Tiny Snapshots is up and running again with "Tiny Järvafält" as the latest addition – Go have a look and tell me what you think. "We knew the world would not be the same. A few people laughed, a few people cried, most people were silent. I remembered the line from the Hindu scripture, the Bhagavad-Gita. Vishnu is trying to persuade the Prince that he should do his duty and to impress him takes on his multi-armed form and says, 'Now, I am become Death, the destroyer of worlds.' I suppose we all thought that, one way or another." /Robert Oppenheimer on witnessing the first thermonuclear detonation in history.

09-17-2006, 03:52 PM	#74
Jav400 Administrator Join Date: Dec 2000 Location: Tennessee Posts: 9,725	Remember Jim, this is only within the miracle stage, it should only take minutes. Michael Administrator of Inside:SereneScreen Aquarium Forum, Chatroom, Fan Site & *Gallery* DVD Collection

09-18-2006, 09:21 AM	#76
Tiny Turtle is pleased Join Date: Mar 2001 Location: Stockholm, Sweden Posts: 7,365	Ok. Upon further googling, Im stating to think that's not an Elephant ear mushroom coral which is green in color, but the "Giant Cup mushroom" which sometimes is called "Giant Elephant ear coral" (Amplexidiscus fenestrafer). More pics: 1 2 3 4 5. I don't know if it's of any help to you, but I figure it was worh a shot. /TT Thanks to Morgan, Tiny Snapshots is up and running again with "Tiny Järvafält" as the latest addition – Go have a look and tell me what you think. "We knew the world would not be the same. A few people laughed, a few people cried, most people were silent. I remembered the line from the Hindu scripture, the Bhagavad-Gita. Vishnu is trying to persuade the Prince that he should do his duty and to impress him takes on his multi-armed form and says, 'Now, I am become Death, the destroyer of worlds.' I suppose we all thought that, one way or another." /Robert Oppenheimer on witnessing the first thermonuclear detonation in history.

09-18-2006, 09:33 AM	#77
Jim Sachs Developer Join Date: Dec 2000 Location: Southern Oregon Posts: 9,791	Thanks, TT, but I need a shot of that exact (long-dead) coral from a little higher angle. The idea is that when MA3 pops up, the first impression is that you are looking at the current version, then the camera starts to pan and you realize that it's a 3D environment. Not everything in the current background picture can be used exactly as is, but that one piece of coral is probably the most recognizable item in the tank. Jim Sachs Creator of SereneScreen Aquarium Last edited by Jim Sachs; 09-18-2006 at 10:33 AM.

09-18-2006, 09:50 AM	#78
nicksteel Registered Join Date: Nov 2001 Location: Mississippi (and no, I don't watch FOX!) Posts: 244	BANGKOK, Thailand - Scientists combing through undersea fauna off Indonesia's Papua province said Monday they had discovered dozens of new species, including a shark that walks on its fins and a shrimp that looks like a praying mantis. Todays' Yahoo. "a shrimp that looks like a praying mantis" could be an interesting addition. Can't find picture yet.

09-18-2006, 10:09 AM	#79
Jav400 Administrator Join Date: Dec 2000 Location: Tennessee Posts: 9,725	Well that sounds interesting, find a decent photo and I will add it to the special creatures section of the web page. Michael Administrator of Inside:SereneScreen Aquarium Forum, Chatroom, Fan Site & *Gallery* DVD Collection

09-19-2006, 03:17 AM	#80
Tiny Turtle is pleased Join Date: Mar 2001 Location: Stockholm, Sweden Posts: 7,365	Jim, I figured you were looking for something likt that, but I fear I can't help you with the hand-pixling of that one... Nick, In a nature show on the TV a creature that looks so unique it's almost unnatural is a very cool thing. In a program like this the aimhas to be for the creatures to look as realistic as possible or everything in the tank will appear fake. What I'm trying to say is that footage of a fish with four eyes and a head that glows in the dark would be super cool, but if you put it in MA3 it would look about as relistic as if the lionfish had Homer Simpson's face... /Tiny Parade-rainer Thanks to Morgan, Tiny Snapshots is up and running again with "Tiny Järvafält" as the latest addition – Go have a look and tell me what you think. "We knew the world would not be the same. A few people laughed, a few people cried, most people were silent. I remembered the line from the Hindu scripture, the Bhagavad-Gita. Vishnu is trying to persuade the Prince that he should do his duty and to impress him takes on his multi-armed form and says, 'Now, I am become Death, the destroyer of worlds.' I suppose we all thought that, one way or another." /Robert Oppenheimer on witnessing the first thermonuclear detonation in history.