A few things about MA2...

avelanchefan · 03-25-2003, 04:26 PM

First thing I noticed was that you should set the programs resolution exactly to your CPU's resolution. I found (at least on mine) that sometimes it would not switch correctly.

Also when I bought this 14 months ago version 1.0 and up would not work on my wifes laptop. I decided to try it (again...) and this time it works. Why? I have no clue at all. In fact her computer has only 8 mb of video memory.

Also what is the standard fps? My new computer(P4 2.53 ghx/128mb nvidia GeForce4 MX 440) runs it at 60-62 fps. Which I feel is fine. My wifes cpu( AMD duron 900/8mb Rage ATI) runs at 20 fps. This also looks fairly good, but I see some aliasing. But you have to look real hard to see it.

I saw the thread that had some people running at 300+ fps. So when does it run to overkill? 30/60/100 fps? Just curious.

By the way it looks rock solid on my 17inch flat panel monitor. :-)

feldon34 · 03-25-2003, 06:50 PM

That ATI Rage 8MB chipset in your wife's laptop is working its tail off to produce 20fps. There has been quite a bit of optimization to keep the Aquarium working on 8MB cards.

In contrast, the GeForce MX440 in your supertower isn't even breaking a sweat, being capable of producing a few hundred frames per second on your setup.

If you had a CRT monitor, then I would make some suggestions on tweaking your settings, but on an LCD, things don't really "refresh" so to speak so I think you're in perfect shape.

CRT monitors refresh 60, 72, 75, 80, etc. times per second. The image is "painted" and then has a few nanoseconds to start fading before the next painting happens, which is almost a flash because it is so bright. Your brain glues together the distinct frames into motion, but 60 or, even worse, 50 flashes per second gives me a headache and is very fatiguing on the eyes.

So that is why you have people doing all kinds of tweaking to turn up the refresh to 75 or 85 and then, separately because they are not tied together, setting DirectX to run at 75 or 85 as well.

But this is not necessary on your LCD since it does not refresh in this manner.

avelanchefan · 03-25-2003, 09:25 PM

So just out of curiousity, how would I configure my video card to get more frames per second? I have tried some minor tweaks but it still runs at 60.

Also my monitor is LCD, so I guess the refresh thing is all moot.

Thanks for the reply.

feldon34 · 03-26-2003, 11:24 AM

Refresh rate is the number of times per second that the contents of the video card's memory are sent to your monitor. Even if the Aquarium generates 200 frames per second, if your refresh rate is 60 Hz, then only 60 distinct images are being seen on the monitor.

If your LCD can be set higher than 60Hz refresh, then you can benefit from higher FPS in the Aquarium as well.

What is preventing more frames per second from automatically working is the DirectX refresh setting for your LCD. Microsoft, in its infinite wisdom, separated the refresh rate of your Windows from the refresh rate when running DirectX applications.

Please go your Display Properties (right-click on the desktop and chose Properties or go to Control Panel) and go to the Settings tab. Click the Advanced button in the lower right corner to bring up the Advanced window. Now click the Monitor tab. The refresh rate there is the max your monitor is capable of. If it says Optimal, click it to reveal the menu. The highest number there is the highest your monitor is capable of.

If it's higher than 60, then go to Start menu, Run, type dxdiag and click OK.

After a few moments, a window will appear and finish searching the system for DX components. Click the More Info tab.

In the center right, click the Override... button (on the same line as ...DirectDraw refresh rate.... The Default is 60. You can override this with whatever your monitor can handle.

I have mine set to 85.

Again, I am thinking this is not a big deal on LCDs, but I haven't heard definitively one way or the other about refresh rates + LCDs. So you can be our guinea pig.

cjmaddy · 03-26-2003, 12:20 PM

That is excellent Morgan! ..... very well set out!

Now, - how about 'Part 2' ..... 'Getting the best out of video cards' .... To v-sync/AA, or not to v-sync/AA! - etc!

(eg. - Tell us the setting/tweaks you use for your GF2MX400 ..... please! )

feldon34 · 03-26-2003, 12:35 PM

Well, vsync basically says "generate however many frames per second you want, regardless of the refresh rate."

I'm not sure why this generates smoother animation on some systems. Probably a timing issue.

I have dxdiag set to 85 refresh. And I run the Aquarium 1024x768 16 bit. That's the sum total of my tweaks.

I do turn on 2x anti-aliasing and anisotropic filtering sometimes because the fish look better, but the blurring effect on the coral is frustrating. Also, FPS drops to 40. Also, if I turn off anisotropic filtering but leave on AA, some of the coral is sharp, some is blurry.

I am anxious for the 3D background and hope Jim will not shy away from 4-bit or 8-bit alpha.

avelanchefan · 03-26-2003, 03:53 PM

Feldon27
Thank you for the tutorial. Everything worked just like you said it would. Here is a pic, jumped from 60 to 70. My LCD does not support more than 70. I can override but I may damage the unit. So 70 is fine for me.

03-25-2003, 04:26 PM	#1
avelanchefan Registered Join Date: Dec 2001 Location: Arizona Posts: 12	A few things about MA2... First thing I noticed was that you should set the programs resolution exactly to your CPU's resolution. I found (at least on mine) that sometimes it would not switch correctly. Also when I bought this 14 months ago version 1.0 and up would not work on my wifes laptop. I decided to try it (again...) and this time it works. Why? I have no clue at all. In fact her computer has only 8 mb of video memory. Also what is the standard fps? My new computer(P4 2.53 ghx/128mb nvidia GeForce4 MX 440) runs it at 60-62 fps. Which I feel is fine. My wifes cpu( AMD duron 900/8mb Rage ATI) runs at 20 fps. This also looks fairly good, but I see some aliasing. But you have to look real hard to see it. I saw the thread that had some people running at 300+ fps. So when does it run to overkill? 30/60/100 fps? Just curious. By the way it looks rock solid on my 17inch flat panel monitor. :-)

03-25-2003, 06:50 PM	#2
feldon34 Forum Administrator Join Date: Dec 2000 Location: Rock Hill, SC Posts: 10,938	That ATI Rage 8MB chipset in your wife's laptop is working its tail off to produce 20fps. There has been quite a bit of optimization to keep the Aquarium working on 8MB cards. In contrast, the GeForce MX440 in your supertower isn't even breaking a sweat, being capable of producing a few hundred frames per second on your setup. If you had a CRT monitor, then I would make some suggestions on tweaking your settings, but on an LCD, things don't really "refresh" so to speak so I think you're in perfect shape. CRT monitors refresh 60, 72, 75, 80, etc. times per second. The image is "painted" and then has a few nanoseconds to start fading before the next painting happens, which is almost a flash because it is so bright. Your brain glues together the distinct frames into motion, but 60 or, even worse, 50 flashes per second gives me a headache and is very fatiguing on the eyes. So that is why you have people doing all kinds of tweaking to turn up the refresh to 75 or 85 and then, separately because they are not tied together, setting DirectX to run at 75 or 85 as well. But this is not necessary on your LCD since it does not refresh in this manner. "Journalism is printing what someone else does not want printed. Everything else is public relations." - George Orwell "If voting changed anything, they'd make it illegal." - Emma Goldman

03-26-2003, 11:24 AM	#4
feldon34 Forum Administrator Join Date: Dec 2000 Location: Rock Hill, SC Posts: 10,938	Refresh rate is the number of times per second that the contents of the video card's memory are sent to your monitor. Even if the Aquarium generates 200 frames per second, if your refresh rate is 60 Hz, then only 60 distinct images are being seen on the monitor. If your LCD can be set higher than 60Hz refresh, then you can benefit from higher FPS in the Aquarium as well. What is preventing more frames per second from automatically working is the DirectX refresh setting for your LCD. Microsoft, in its infinite wisdom, separated the refresh rate of your Windows from the refresh rate when running DirectX applications. Please go your Display Properties (right-click on the desktop and chose Properties or go to Control Panel) and go to the Settings tab. Click the Advanced button in the lower right corner to bring up the Advanced window. Now click the Monitor tab. The refresh rate there is the max your monitor is capable of. If it says Optimal, click it to reveal the menu. The highest number there is the highest your monitor is capable of. If it's higher than 60, then go to Start menu, Run, type dxdiag and click OK. After a few moments, a window will appear and finish searching the system for DX components. Click the More Info tab. In the center right, click the Override... button (on the same line as ...DirectDraw refresh rate.... The Default is 60. You can override this with whatever your monitor can handle. I have mine set to 85. Again, I am thinking this is not a big deal on LCDs, but I haven't heard definitively one way or the other about refresh rates + LCDs. So you can be our guinea pig. "Journalism is printing what someone else does not want printed. Everything else is public relations." - George Orwell "If voting changed anything, they'd make it illegal." - Emma Goldman

03-26-2003, 12:35 PM	#6
feldon34 Forum Administrator Join Date: Dec 2000 Location: Rock Hill, SC Posts: 10,938	Well, vsync basically says "generate however many frames per second you want, regardless of the refresh rate." I'm not sure why this generates smoother animation on some systems. Probably a timing issue. I have dxdiag set to 85 refresh. And I run the Aquarium 1024x768 16 bit. That's the sum total of my tweaks. I do turn on 2x anti-aliasing and anisotropic filtering sometimes because the fish look better, but the blurring effect on the coral is frustrating. Also, FPS drops to 40. Also, if I turn off anisotropic filtering but leave on AA, some of the coral is sharp, some is blurry. I am anxious for the 3D background and hope Jim will not shy away from 4-bit or 8-bit alpha. "Journalism is printing what someone else does not want printed. Everything else is public relations." - George Orwell "If voting changed anything, they'd make it illegal." - Emma Goldman

03-25-2003, 09:25 PM	#3
avelanchefan Registered Join Date: Dec 2001 Location: Arizona Posts: 12	So just out of curiousity, how would I configure my video card to get more frames per second? I have tried some minor tweaks but it still runs at 60. Also my monitor is LCD, so I guess the refresh thing is all moot. Thanks for the reply.

03-26-2003, 12:20 PM	#5
cjmaddy Registered Join Date: Nov 2001 Location: Lancashire, UK Posts: 7,854	That is excellent Morgan! ..... very well set out! Now, - how about 'Part 2' ..... 'Getting the best out of video cards' .... To v-sync/AA, or not to v-sync/AA! - etc! (eg. - Tell us the setting/tweaks you use for your GF2MX400 ..... please! )