Marine Aquarium 2.6 for iPhone and iPad

JimO'Connor · 04-01-2010, 03:27 PM

If you go to the App Store in iTunes you can see we have just released Marine Aquarium 2.6 for the iPhone and iPad. This is the real thing.

Please let us know how you like it.

Marine Aquarium 2.6 Product Page in the iPhone App Store

Ralph · 04-01-2010, 08:49 PM

Why... would you waste time re developing a program made obsolete by MA3? You squeeze a few pennies out of it but will annoy all your customers when they realize they bought an out of date program and MA3 is where it is at.

feldon34 · 04-01-2010, 08:57 PM

Just downloaded it to my iPhone. It runs great, and has most of the settings for Marine Aquarium 2.6 for PC/Mac. Impressive for $0.99!

feldon34 · 04-01-2010, 08:57 PM

Originally posted by Ralph:

Why... would you waste time re developing a program made obsolete by MA3? You squeeze a few pennies out of it but will annoy all your customers when they realize they bought an out of date program and MA3 is where it is at.

Because Marine Aquarium 2.6 "fits" better on the iPhone than Marine Aquarium 3. And it's $0.99, which is a very good price for it.

Marine Aquarium 3 may not be possible on the iPhone because of its use of shaders and large screen width.

AKcrab · 04-01-2010, 08:58 PM

Maybe due to technical limitations they CAN'T produce 3.0 for the phone/pad/touch?

Jim Sachs · 04-01-2010, 10:18 PM

Yes, it will be a long time before the iPhone / iPad hardware is up to the requirements of MA3.

dom5885 · 04-02-2010, 04:59 AM

Marine Aquarium now graces my PC and my iPhone

JimO'Connor · 04-02-2010, 12:14 PM

Thanks for your support!

JimO'Connor · 04-02-2010, 12:42 PM

Originally posted by Ralph:

Why... would you waste time re developing a program made obsolete by MA3? You squeeze a few pennies out of it but will annoy all your customers when they realize they bought an out of date program and MA3 is where it is at.

Hi Ralph,

Thanks for your thoughts. I hope you are wrong about ticking people off. That wasn't the goal.

Jim

Dathomir · 04-06-2010, 08:22 AM

Just installed to my iPhone.

Runs very nicely and gui is ideal.

Lightkin · 04-08-2010, 12:35 PM

Very cool! Any word on Prolific and when we can purchase Marine Aquarium 3 for Mac?

JimO'Connor · 04-08-2010, 12:37 PM

MA 3 Mac is available on the SereneScreen website generally, but they are having a problem at this particular moment with the website.

Jim Sachs · 04-08-2010, 01:06 PM

Yes, the SereneScreen website was hacked by evil-doers, and is down for repairs.

Michael Babin · 04-09-2010, 10:00 AM

It appears to be back up and running as of this time.

Jim Sachs · 04-09-2010, 10:21 AM

Yes, it's fixed. We lost a day of sales, and two man-days of work for JimR and Edgar to fix it.

rhildinger · 04-15-2010, 10:40 PM

Originally posted by feldon34:

Marine Aquarium 3 may not be possible on the iPhone because of its use of shaders and large screen width.

Originally posted by Jim Sachs:

Yes, it will be a long time before the iPhone / iPad hardware is up to the requirements of MA3.

I'm curious as to the reasoning behind these statements. The iPhone 3Gs and iPad both contain the PowerVR SGX graphics chip, which contains support for most of modern graphics chip features, including:

Programmable graphics pipeline
Pixel shaders
Stencil buffers
Vertex buffer objects
Unified system and graphics memory (up to the entire 256MB RAM can be used for textures)
8 texture units

Seems more than capable to meet the modest requirements of MA3...

-Robert

Jim Sachs · 04-16-2010, 09:21 AM

Traditionally, the iPhone/iPad development environment has not allowed shaders, even if the hardware could handle them. Mike Babin can probably address the issue of whether this policy has changed.

rhildinger · 04-16-2010, 10:51 AM

The iPhone 3Gs and the iPad both support the OpenGL ES 2.0 framework, of which shaders are an integral part. There is actual Apple sample code in the iPhone reference library that builds an OpenGL ES 2.0 application that includes pixel shader code, and the xCode project template for an Open GL iPad application includes the skeleton for writing pixel shaders. I think it's safe to say that any restrictions Apple may have had against shaders has been lifted for the 3Gs and the iPad.

By the way, I hope my statements aren't taken as criticisms in any way. I love MA, and I'm just dying to see the 3.0 version on my iPad!

Michael Babin · 04-16-2010, 02:03 PM

Why is the iPhone/iPad version of MA 2.6? We first started work on the iPhone version of MA back in December 2008. At that time, it was a quick proof-of-concept type project. Would it work? What would the performance be like? At that time, the current iPhone OS was 2.2, and the iPhone 3G was the current model. MA 3 for Windows was still in development, and we had not begun work on the Mac version of MA 3. We got the basic aquarium working with a few bugs, mostly acceptable performance, and a first cut at a rudimentary settings UI. Other projects took priority at that time.

In mid-summer 2009, we had some time open up to work on MA. At that point, MA 3 for Windows was essentially completed. We decided that MA 3 for Mac took priority and we worked on it first. After it was released, we took another look at MA for iPhone. We decided at that point (December 2009) to finish MA 2.6 for iPhone, rather than start over with MA 3 for iPhone. We wanted to deliver a version that could work on all iPhone/Touch models and support back to iPhone OS 2.2.1 (since many original Touch owners had not upgraded to the newer OS). MA 3 required shaders, which required OpenGL ES 2.0 and would limit it to working on the iPhone 3GS and equivalent Touch models (32/64GB). Additionally, the larger tank and improved background in MA 3 were not as visually compelling, in our judgement, on the iPhone screen.

We were nearly done with the iPhone version of MA 2.6 when Apple announced the iPad. We decided at that point to finish MA 2.6 as a universal app for iPhone and iPad. Adding the iPad support was surprisingly simple, although we did have to bump up the minimum required OS for the iPhone to 3.0 (Apple wouldn't allow us to submit a universal app where the iPhone version has a minimum requirement less than iPhone OS 3.0).

We may look into creating a version of MA 3 for iPhone/iPad in the future, although we have no plans to do so at this point. The larger screen on the iPad, in particular, would make this version more appealing. Shader support is present in OpenGL ES 2.0, so it should be possible. We'd have to see what kind of performance we could achieve, which may involve reducing the number of fish in the tank or other measures to reduce the load. There are other factors to consider like the state of the market for apps (the App Store, pricing, level of sales for MA 2.6, etc). We're not making any announcements or promises at this point.

mrtew · 04-18-2010, 09:13 AM

I love it!!! MA3 is way better, but there's something about the over-saturated colours and over-sharpened contrast of MA2 that I've always missed and to have it on the iPhone is super cool. It's like having PacMan on the iPhone... I'm not going to play it all day on my supercomputer but having little bites of the coolest thing from 10 or 20 years ago in my pocket is really wonderful. I'm really glad you did it and that it turned out so great. It's even better than on the computer screen because you can zoom and pan in a way you never could which makes it feel more interactive; not as good as if you'd add actual interaction such as feeding and glass tapping but a really nice addition. And the price is fantastic... hopefully you'll get a million downloads in a month.

04-01-2010, 03:27 PM	#1
JimO'Connor Mac Development Join Date: Jul 2002 Location: Kenai, Alaska Posts: 678	Marine Aquarium 2.6 for iPhone and iPad If you go to the App Store in iTunes you can see we have just released Marine Aquarium 2.6 for the iPhone and iPad. This is the real thing. Please let us know how you like it. Marine Aquarium 2.6 Product Page in the iPhone App Store Jim O'Connor Order N Development

04-01-2010, 08:57 PM	#3
feldon34 Forum Administrator Join Date: Dec 2000 Location: Rock Hill, SC Posts: 10,939	Just downloaded it to my iPhone. It runs great, and has most of the settings for Marine Aquarium 2.6 for PC/Mac. Impressive for $0.99! "Journalism is printing what someone else does not want printed. Everything else is public relations." - George Orwell "If voting changed anything, they'd make it illegal." - Emma Goldman

04-01-2010, 08:57 PM	#4
feldon34 Forum Administrator Join Date: Dec 2000 Location: Rock Hill, SC Posts: 10,939	Originally posted by Ralph: Why... would you waste time re developing a program made obsolete by MA3? You squeeze a few pennies out of it but will annoy all your customers when they realize they bought an out of date program and MA3 is where it is at. Because Marine Aquarium 2.6 "fits" better on the iPhone than Marine Aquarium 3. And it's $0.99, which is a very good price for it. Marine Aquarium 3 may not be possible on the iPhone because of its use of shaders and large screen width. "Journalism is printing what someone else does not want printed. Everything else is public relations." - George Orwell "If voting changed anything, they'd make it illegal." - Emma Goldman

04-01-2010, 10:18 PM	#6
Jim Sachs Developer Join Date: Dec 2000 Location: Southern Oregon Posts: 9,788	Yes, it will be a long time before the iPhone / iPad hardware is up to the requirements of MA3. Jim Sachs Creator of SereneScreen Aquarium

04-02-2010, 12:14 PM	#8
JimO'Connor Mac Development Join Date: Jul 2002 Location: Kenai, Alaska Posts: 678	Thanks for your support! Jim O'Connor Order N Development

04-01-2010, 08:49 PM	#2
Ralph Retired Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: Edmonton Alberta Ca Posts: 2,441	Why... would you waste time re developing a program made obsolete by MA3? You squeeze a few pennies out of it but will annoy all your customers when they realize they bought an out of date program and MA3 is where it is at.

04-01-2010, 08:58 PM	#5
AKcrab Registered Join Date: Mar 2003 Posts: 233	Maybe due to technical limitations they CAN'T produce 3.0 for the phone/pad/touch?

04-02-2010, 04:59 AM	#7
dom5885 Registered Join Date: May 2006 Location: Sydney, Australia Posts: 17	Marine Aquarium now graces my PC and my iPhone

04-02-2010, 12:42 PM	#9
JimO'Connor Mac Development Join Date: Jul 2002 Location: Kenai, Alaska Posts: 678	Originally posted by Ralph: Why... would you waste time re developing a program made obsolete by MA3? You squeeze a few pennies out of it but will annoy all your customers when they realize they bought an out of date program and MA3 is where it is at. Hi Ralph, Thanks for your thoughts. I hope you are wrong about ticking people off. That wasn't the goal. Jim Jim O'Connor Order N Development

04-06-2010, 08:22 AM	#10
Dathomir Registered Join Date: Oct 2002 Location: Limerick, Ireland Posts: 8	Just installed to my iPhone. Runs very nicely and gui is ideal.

04-08-2010, 12:35 PM	#11
Lightkin Registered Join Date: Dec 2005 Location: usually sunny San Diego, CA USA Posts: 10	Very cool! Any word on Prolific and when we can purchase Marine Aquarium 3 for Mac?

04-08-2010, 12:37 PM	#12
JimO'Connor Mac Development Join Date: Jul 2002 Location: Kenai, Alaska Posts: 678	MA 3 Mac is available on the SereneScreen website generally, but they are having a problem at this particular moment with the website. Jim O'Connor Order N Development

04-08-2010, 01:06 PM	#13
Jim Sachs Developer Join Date: Dec 2000 Location: Southern Oregon Posts: 9,788	Yes, the SereneScreen website was hacked by evil-doers, and is down for repairs. Jim Sachs Creator of SereneScreen Aquarium

04-09-2010, 10:00 AM	#14
Michael Babin Mac Development Join Date: Jul 2002 Location: Rowlett, Texas Posts: 199	It appears to be back up and running as of this time.

04-09-2010, 10:21 AM	#15
Jim Sachs Developer Join Date: Dec 2000 Location: Southern Oregon Posts: 9,788	Yes, it's fixed. We lost a day of sales, and two man-days of work for JimR and Edgar to fix it. Jim Sachs Creator of SereneScreen Aquarium

04-15-2010, 10:40 PM	#16
rhildinger Registered Join Date: Feb 2008 Posts: 6	Originally posted by feldon34: Marine Aquarium 3 may not be possible on the iPhone because of its use of shaders and large screen width. Originally posted by Jim Sachs: Yes, it will be a long time before the iPhone / iPad hardware is up to the requirements of MA3. I'm curious as to the reasoning behind these statements. The iPhone 3Gs and iPad both contain the PowerVR SGX graphics chip, which contains support for most of modern graphics chip features, including: Programmable graphics pipeline Pixel shaders Stencil buffers Vertex buffer objects Unified system and graphics memory (up to the entire 256MB RAM can be used for textures) 8 texture units Seems more than capable to meet the modest requirements of MA3... -Robert

04-16-2010, 09:21 AM	#17
Jim Sachs Developer Join Date: Dec 2000 Location: Southern Oregon Posts: 9,788	Traditionally, the iPhone/iPad development environment has not allowed shaders, even if the hardware could handle them. Mike Babin can probably address the issue of whether this policy has changed. Jim Sachs Creator of SereneScreen Aquarium

04-16-2010, 10:51 AM	#18
rhildinger Registered Join Date: Feb 2008 Posts: 6	The iPhone 3Gs and the iPad both support the OpenGL ES 2.0 framework, of which shaders are an integral part. There is actual Apple sample code in the iPhone reference library that builds an OpenGL ES 2.0 application that includes pixel shader code, and the xCode project template for an Open GL iPad application includes the skeleton for writing pixel shaders. I think it's safe to say that any restrictions Apple may have had against shaders has been lifted for the 3Gs and the iPad. By the way, I hope my statements aren't taken as criticisms in any way. I love MA, and I'm just dying to see the 3.0 version on my iPad!

04-16-2010, 02:03 PM	#19
Michael Babin Mac Development Join Date: Jul 2002 Location: Rowlett, Texas Posts: 199	Why is the iPhone/iPad version of MA 2.6? We first started work on the iPhone version of MA back in December 2008. At that time, it was a quick proof-of-concept type project. Would it work? What would the performance be like? At that time, the current iPhone OS was 2.2, and the iPhone 3G was the current model. MA 3 for Windows was still in development, and we had not begun work on the Mac version of MA 3. We got the basic aquarium working with a few bugs, mostly acceptable performance, and a first cut at a rudimentary settings UI. Other projects took priority at that time. In mid-summer 2009, we had some time open up to work on MA. At that point, MA 3 for Windows was essentially completed. We decided that MA 3 for Mac took priority and we worked on it first. After it was released, we took another look at MA for iPhone. We decided at that point (December 2009) to finish MA 2.6 for iPhone, rather than start over with MA 3 for iPhone. We wanted to deliver a version that could work on all iPhone/Touch models and support back to iPhone OS 2.2.1 (since many original Touch owners had not upgraded to the newer OS). MA 3 required shaders, which required OpenGL ES 2.0 and would limit it to working on the iPhone 3GS and equivalent Touch models (32/64GB). Additionally, the larger tank and improved background in MA 3 were not as visually compelling, in our judgement, on the iPhone screen. We were nearly done with the iPhone version of MA 2.6 when Apple announced the iPad. We decided at that point to finish MA 2.6 as a universal app for iPhone and iPad. Adding the iPad support was surprisingly simple, although we did have to bump up the minimum required OS for the iPhone to 3.0 (Apple wouldn't allow us to submit a universal app where the iPhone version has a minimum requirement less than iPhone OS 3.0). We may look into creating a version of MA 3 for iPhone/iPad in the future, although we have no plans to do so at this point. The larger screen on the iPad, in particular, would make this version more appealing. Shader support is present in OpenGL ES 2.0, so it should be possible. We'd have to see what kind of performance we could achieve, which may involve reducing the number of fish in the tank or other measures to reduce the load. There are other factors to consider like the state of the market for apps (the App Store, pricing, level of sales for MA 2.6, etc). We're not making any announcements or promises at this point.

04-18-2010, 09:13 AM	#20
mrtew Registered Join Date: Jul 2002 Location: michigan Posts: 109	I love it!!! MA3 is way better, but there's something about the over-saturated colours and over-sharpened contrast of MA2 that I've always missed and to have it on the iPhone is super cool. It's like having PacMan on the iPhone... I'm not going to play it all day on my supercomputer but having little bites of the coolest thing from 10 or 20 years ago in my pocket is really wonderful. I'm really glad you did it and that it turned out so great. It's even better than on the computer screen because you can zoom and pan in a way you never could which makes it feel more interactive; not as good as if you'd add actual interaction such as feeding and glass tapping but a really nice addition. And the price is fantastic... hopefully you'll get a million downloads in a month. mrtew